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shpauly
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Posted: Sun Jun 13th, 2010 09:33 pm |
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Wesley wrote: "Uncannily"
I had a 1994 "L" Rover Metro in with "cat fitted" today, it failed the initial BET test and the gas analyser automatically took me to the other options. make, model, vin, and engine code? not listed so had a peek under the air fiter housing and discovered "ye" old`e" carburettor, chose "other" from the options list and "Bingo"! Passed.
lambda part of test isnt testing the lambda sensor its measuring the lambda which is always there regardless,a car withot a o2 sensor will stll have lambda
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Wesley
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Posted: Thu Jun 10th, 2010 10:26 pm |
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"Uncannily"
I had a 1994 "L" Rover Metro in with "cat fitted" today, it failed the initial BET test and the gas analyser automatically took me to the other options. make, model, vin, and engine code? not listed so had a peek under the air fiter housing and discovered "ye" old`e" carburettor, chose "other" from the options list and "Bingo"! Passed.
Last edited on Thu Jun 10th, 2010 11:32 pm by Wesley
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volksjim
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Posted: Thu Jun 10th, 2010 07:30 pm |
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shame on the tester though for not puttin his hands up sadly you could do 1,000s
of good mot's and c0ck_up on one and lose your livelyhood i wouldnt trust anyone that made an error and never admitted to it too!!
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kit1958
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Posted: Thu Jun 10th, 2010 05:47 pm |
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Glad tht you have learnt a small bit of the testers world, a balance between keeping the boss, vosa and yourself happy. Somtimes mistakes are made, any one who says that thay don't either dosn't do much or is kidding themselves. Usully most "issues" are resolved quickly without the involvment of vosa, becuse of the system of information available and quality control etc.
I hope that the tester involved learns his lesson without to much pain involved
Cheers, if you hear any more let us know.
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secubis3
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Posted: Thu Jun 10th, 2010 11:13 am |
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kit1958, yes I agree that mistakes are made and I understand that mot testers are under a lot of pressure. I do trust them because as far as I am concerned they are top notch mechanics who know what they are doing. So when you come across one that has got it wrong and not held up his hands then I do want to do something about it. The guy at VOSA said that he just may need more training or a refresher course as older cars are now becoming less evident on the roads.
Volksjim, No I didn't take offence at your comments, I learn something new everyday and taking onboard other peoples views, ideas and suggestions is a way of life. But when something is wrong.it is wrong.
I just hope that all parties involved learn a lesson from what has happened, I know I have.
Cheers
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kit1958
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Posted: Wed Jun 9th, 2010 07:45 pm |
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It all sounds a bit complicated, yes we ALL make mistakes, but it does sound like your first tester need some help in understading emmision requirments and how to use his equipment (oh err Mrs!!)
All emmision testers in current use are quite capable of testing all makes, models and years of car on uk roads.
Your concern will only be used for intel. as it it is not an official appeal, becuse you have had repairs done & therfore cannot be examined "as presented", but it may well prompt a visit by a vosa examiner who may well ask for a demo test by the tester involved.
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volksjim
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Posted: Wed Jun 9th, 2010 07:28 pm |
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| if the correct details were put into gas analyser..then it should have went into pre 93 two gas test automatically..sorry if you have took offence at my reply..we ALL make mistakes from time to time...you can please some of the people some of the time.........
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secubis3
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Posted: Wed Jun 9th, 2010 05:47 pm |
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I've got a reply and spoke with the garage and they stated that as their machine does not have the option to test a vehicle with a cat as a vehicle without a cat then it was tested with a cat!!! clear so far???????
I then explained that he could test, but did not have the knowledge as he may not have had to test a car that does not have a Lambda on the cat, after all my car is 1993 L reg with a carb!!! no ecu and the most sofisticated eletronics within the car is the original radio cassette player
his reply was if it has a cat it will be tested as a cat but no explanation as to how he can test a Lamda when there is none to test...
Contacted VOSA enforcement and they stated that a cat without a Lambda or any sort of sensor attached, only directly from manufacture has to be treated as an ordinary exhaust. As cats and Lambda came in at the mid to end of 1993 and production of my car ended in 1994 the manufacturer was not required by law to fit Lambda to base models or models without ecu.
The emmissions would still fail (this I was aware of as I normally have a full service with the mot) but reading would not be such a silly high figure, and the cost of repair was well in access of any acceptable standards: £260 where as the real figure was £20.
I need to put my unoffical complaint in writing as it can only be used for intelligence?
as I have had the repairs done already. They will require to see me later and check to make sure that the garage knows how to use their equipment correctly and that they are fully qualified to use the equipment, for cars with and without testable cats.
Bit of a long post but it has been a very complicated day
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secubis3
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Posted: Wed Jun 9th, 2010 12:45 am |
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It is used as an Analogy...but outside the rhetoric, (Analogies should make those abstractions easier to understand) ie..understanding a complex situation by placing it into a context, where understanding in a basic form and more familiar area of experience.
Not inappropriate, just put simpler but with more stark realisation.
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secubis3
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Posted: Tue Jun 8th, 2010 09:26 pm |
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thanks kit1958, that's two things I've learned tonight,
There is a local vosa area office, and non testable item is a correct term.
Cheers
S
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kit1958
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Posted: Tue Jun 8th, 2010 08:53 pm |
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Existance of cat, there or not, is not an issue. The only thing that counts on an emmisions test is the result, and correct pass/fail jugment made.
Any tester who knows his a*se from his elbow should know this.
Ring your local vosa area office, and yes, non testable item is a correct term.
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secubis3
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Posted: Tue Jun 8th, 2010 08:45 pm |
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Yes, I was a bit miffed about it as I knew if the car failed on anything it would be emmissions, as it is something I have not yet mastered, but it is the fact they tested a non testable (is that a word?) cat with a non existant Lambda sensor, something they should have discovered when they checked the exhaust system.
It is like going to the dentist for a sore tooth and being diagnosed with cancer and being told you need to pay for private treatment to have a chance of surviving!!!!
The second mot examiner, whom I did not inform of the first test, the first question he asked me was "Does your car have a cat, with or without sensor...."
Having driven for 30 yrs this is the first time I have come across a cowboy like this, so I don't can't put it down to experience, as I have too much experience to turn and walk away.
I ahve written to the mot station expressing my dis-satisfaction and am awaiting their reply
Last edited on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 08:48 pm by secubis3
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kit1958
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Posted: Tue Jun 8th, 2010 08:27 pm |
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HI, welcome to the forum. It sounds like you are a bit miffed at your 1st test, gone to a second mot station for a second opinion and after a few small adjustments got a pass (vt20) .
If you realy unhappy about your fail (vt30) you could report your concerns to your local area office as an unofficial complaint, as it is not an oficial complaint (appeal), as an appeal will not be appropriate as you have had repairs done, and an inspection by a vosa official would not be checking the car in it's original (failed) condition.
Ask at the mot station for the phone number, I am sure they would be happy to help.
Let us know how you get on, cheers
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volksjim
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Posted: Tue Jun 8th, 2010 08:14 pm |
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| an error of judgement on gas-test methinks..put i down to experience sir.. i remember testin them when they were three years old
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secubis3
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Posted: Tue Jun 8th, 2010 07:28 pm |
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I have a 1993 Rover Maestro 1.3 Clubman (Ok stop laughing now and read on!)
It is fitted with a cat but no Lambda sensor.
When I got the sheet and read it at home it stated emmissions test for a
MG Rover Metro/Rover 100 model code xp. Now as I don't own this vehicle type why was it tested as one? Oh and just in case, there is a difference between a Rover and an MG Rover (Premier league and first division in simple terms)
They also tested the Lambda sensor, now I know my Maestro does not have one of these.
They also stated that I needed to replace my cat and the Lambda sensor at a cost of £240-£260. Now as my cat does not require this test and the Lambda sensor is non existant on my vehicle, how can I redress this glaring blunder?
I believe they have not done a proper mot on my vehicle as other items were picked up and rectified later.
I have had the vehicle re-mot'd at another garage and it passed, after a few adjustments by the mechanic for £70 all in saving me at least £170.
Cheers
Stewart
Last edited on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 07:32 pm by secubis3
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