board_home 

Visit the
UK MOT Testing
Industry Website


Autotech Training Services


 Moderated by: Stealth, MOTman, KevG, bimmer
New Topic Reply Printer Friendly
VOSA Not much help  Rating:  Rating
AuthorPost
 Posted: Wed Jun 29th, 2011 08:08 pm
  PM Quote Reply
1st Post
kit1958
Trade Member


Joined: Sat May 15th, 2010
Location: The Finest Country On Earth , United Kingdom
Posts: 1099
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Can't wait, it's a riveting read :D

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Wed Jun 29th, 2011 07:44 pm
  PM Quote Reply
2nd Post
martins
Administrator


Joined: Sat May 27th, 2006
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 349
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
kit1958 wrote: ...it aint all brake pipes and ball joints you know !!
Thanks for the plug Kit.

We interviewed Mike Penning about 4-2-2 at the DfT on Monday - full report in the August issue.

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Wed Jun 29th, 2011 07:37 pm
  PM Quote Reply
3rd Post
kit1958
Trade Member


Joined: Sat May 15th, 2010
Location: The Finest Country On Earth , United Kingdom
Posts: 1099
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
I have looked into this myself a couple of years ago and found one of the few supplyers to publish prices is boston equipment, http://www.boston-ge.com/boston-finance.php, but I do not endorse there equipment as I do not use it, or indeed know any one that does. This is not an advert or recomendation, just pointing out that info is availabe if you look. If you subscribe to the mag that goes with this forum you will find loads of ads and usfull info about standards and procedures, it aint all brake pipes and ball joints you know !!

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 11:29 pm
  PM Quote Reply
4th Post
Wesley
Trade Member
 

Joined: Tue Sep 25th, 2007
Location: Wanted
Posts: 1841
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
to purchase outright, would cost £30K+, with limited back up and possibly expensive annual updates for DSM and Calibrations. (other posts)

with a "lease purchase" agreement, (monthly payments over five years), with the right package, you should be able to have good deal which includes everything.

shop around, ask the questions, ask the guys on here what equipment they use and what service they actually get for their money.

try not to go down the road of "cut priced mot`s" as this will be your downfall.;) 

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 10:18 pm
  PM Quote Reply
5th Post
JA1000
Member
 

Joined: Mon Jun 27th, 2011
Location:  
Posts: 5
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Following the information on this link I have now started to look at packages but a lot of web sites just don't give prices so it's difficult to gauge for my finances.

I am keen to purchase outright but I think the new element would not suit me but I'll see.

Thanks for the help

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 09:48 pm
  PM Quote Reply
6th Post
getech.org.uk
Member
 

Joined: Fri Jun 24th, 2011
Location: Leeds, United Kingdom
Posts: 52
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Bottom line you go for complient second or new you can go one person testing as an ATL...

If you go 2nd hand look for continuity in spares availablility, no point saving money if it falls apart after 5 minutes and can't be fixed. New kit can be bought now under a lease so you pay next to nothing on the entire bay and its very tax efficient.

The very question you are raising is self-answering! you are considering 2nd hand to save money and equipment manufacturers have a bottom product to get people up and running as cheaply as possible, after all its a competitve market! Such products are not necessarily future proofed. An honest company will advise you appropriately and your questioning here definately will stand you in good stead - after all forewarned is forearmed!

My advice: go for new upgradeable equipment to keep your costs down whilst keeping your options to meet the known future legislation changes.

As far as the lack of continuuiity in paperwork and web details... get used to it! I was at a sign off this week for one of my customers and the VE downloaded the latest sign off sheet from their intranet. It still had pre-Jan 2010 dimensional regulations on as the VE's reference point! :D 

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 09:30 pm
  PM Quote Reply
7th Post
JA1000
Member
 

Joined: Mon Jun 27th, 2011
Location:  
Posts: 5
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Excellent thank you,

Again on Business Link not VOSA, not sure why they do this.

So bottom line if I go for everything ATL second hand or new this will give me one person testing.  I think I am caught between a cross over of old kit and going whole hog for new kit.

Is there any reason why the vehicle lifts are not included as the most expensive piece of kit I would have thought they would have to comply especially to fit the new kit?

The jigsaw is coming together so I appreciate your help

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 09:09 pm
  PM Quote Reply
8th Post
getech.org.uk
Member
 

Joined: Fri Jun 24th, 2011
Location: Leeds, United Kingdom
Posts: 52
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
A standard test lane requires 2 men to operate.

An automated test lane requires 1 man to operate as there is an additional weighin facility and ATL program on the RBT and the lift has play detectors fitted to check suspension and steering components.

OPTL is essentially a half way house where EXISTING test stations can fit the play detectors to the lift/pit and keep the standard brake tester whilst being allowed to do a one man test. As you are not existing this is no good to you...

Acceptable equipment link can be found here...

http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/layer?r.i=1082073359&r.l1=1081597476&r.l2=1082103262&r.l3=1084755756&r.l4=1082073031&r.s=m&r.t=RESOURCES&topicId=1082073031

Essentially you just need a way in to VOSA to have a meaningful conversation i.e finding a helpful VE. My advice is to search online for some equipment suppliers and talk to them, (You could use my name as guidance on this as well!) Speaking to several of these companies will make you life a whole lot easier as these companies do everything including planning application so all you have to do is satisfy yourself you are speaking to the right company, and speaking to a few you will be able to draw a more balanced opinion!

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 09:00 pm
  PM Quote Reply
9th Post
kit1958
Trade Member


Joined: Sat May 15th, 2010
Location: The Finest Country On Earth , United Kingdom
Posts: 1099
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
There are several good supliers of new/used equipment as a google search will show (outher engines are available !)who will be more than happy to give you all the info you want, and help with plans that you will require.
Enjoy!!

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 08:54 pm
  PM Quote Reply
10th Post
JA1000
Member
 

Joined: Mon Jun 27th, 2011
Location:  
Posts: 5
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Thanks for the responses it is starting to make sense but why isn't there some defining document from VOSA, the clause below will mean more to those who are currently running an MOT bay and not one who is looking to set it up hence my research.

So some more questions  ATL / OPTL what are the major differences doesn't everyone operate a OPTL currently?

There is a continual mention of approved list of equipment, I have trawled and search the VOSA website but nothing returns on the search does anyone have a link?

When I phoned up VOSA I asked if second hand equipment is acceptable to be put on hold whilst they checked, they couldn't really answer any other questiuons unless I submit an application. Hence the title.  I could stay in sales and tick along but I have an opportunitry to expand but I need to know every detail every potential flaw before I commit.  Is it possible to have a genuine conversation with VOSA in advance of my commitment or are we dealing with bureacratic service and just put a business link link on their website.

 

5. Equipment Requirements.


5.1 Major Equipment:


a) a means of allowing the underside of vehicles to be properly examined without obstruction or hindrance; (fitted with steering and suspension play detectors on the VOSA List of Acceptable Equipment if an Automated Test Lane (ATL) or One Person Test Lanes (OPTL installation)

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 08:36 pm
  PM Quote Reply
11th Post
getech.org.uk
Member
 

Joined: Fri Jun 24th, 2011
Location: Leeds, United Kingdom
Posts: 52
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Based on what you asked and what has been said here hopefully I can shed some light...

As has been correctly stated, should you go down the second hand route you need to ensure that the equipment manufacturer supports a retrospective upgrade i.e play detectors or brake tester to allow conformance to the scheme. The regulations regarding ATL were first released in 1995, therefore equipment manufactured prior to this date is unlikely to be upgradeable to ATL. You need this evidence anyway as VOSA will require a letter from the lift manufacturer that the lift is designed for the play detectors before they will approve you. As far as the RBT is concerned again check the list of acceptable equipment for which you can cross reference products that may be suitable for upgrade.

The new equipment option gives you 2 options. Either an ATL bay, obviously!, or an upgradeable bay where some manufacturers have both lift and rbt options capable of the necessary retro-fit equipment.

Grandfathering you can forget as you are / will be a new VE, therefore you will have to comply with the scheme at the point at which your Approval In Principle is issued after your VT01 application. Even if you take over an old station, you will have to apply to the current regulations.

Trust this helps

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 07:55 pm
  PM Quote Reply
12th Post
kit1958
Trade Member


Joined: Sat May 15th, 2010
Location: The Finest Country On Earth , United Kingdom
Posts: 1099
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Good link Steath, I may do it myself oneday!!

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Tue Jun 28th, 2011 06:24 pm
  PM Quote Reply
13th Post
Stealth
Super Moderator


Joined: Wed Oct 31st, 2007
Location: Back To Reality, United Kingdom
Posts: 1573
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
There you go ......just use the link & scroll down the page a little ;)

http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/layer?topicId=1082073031

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Mon Jun 27th, 2011 10:31 pm
  PM Quote Reply
14th Post
kit1958
Trade Member


Joined: Sat May 15th, 2010
Location: The Finest Country On Earth , United Kingdom
Posts: 1099
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
ATL equipment is made as atl equipment, howevr it is posible to convert some ramps, but i think that can only be done by the original manufacturer. Convering roller brake tester would be near impossible. Aproved equipment should be no prob new or used as long as it is on the approved list.
Grandfathering involves buying an existing mot station "as is", not setting up from scratch.
Hope that helps

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Mon Jun 27th, 2011 09:10 pm
  PM Quote Reply
15th Post
JA1000
Member
 

Joined: Mon Jun 27th, 2011
Location:  
Posts: 5
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Hi

Thanks for the links, I have seen this info but I don't think it goes to the detail I need or perhaps I am just looking into it too much and it isn't that complicated.

I am concerned that second hand equipment into a new MOT bay is not allowed and is it fully ATL or can I convert it.

Also I have come across 'grandfathering' as a discussion but not a description of what it is.

 

 

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Mon Jun 27th, 2011 08:48 pm
  PM Quote Reply
16th Post
kit1958
Trade Member


Joined: Sat May 15th, 2010
Location: The Finest Country On Earth , United Kingdom
Posts: 1099
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Surly if you ask the seller of said equipment you should get a definative answer :?

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Mon Jun 27th, 2011 07:44 pm
  PM Quote Reply
17th Post
bimmer
Moderator


Joined: Fri Sep 4th, 2009
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 766
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
welcome to the forum. on the Business Link website have you downloaded the pdf files on the right side of the page, if not they might help.

 http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/layer?topicId=1082032326

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Mon Jun 27th, 2011 06:31 pm
  PM Quote Reply
18th Post
JA1000
Member
 

Joined: Mon Jun 27th, 2011
Location:  
Posts: 5
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
I am currently in the process of looking at setting up an MOT station, my experience is only in car sales but I have an opportunity to expand, being technically new to this I am trying to do as much research as possible.

I find the VOSA web site very unfriendly for setting up and they just point you to businss link. Their website is better but doesn't reall answer my questions.  On finally getting hold of VOSA to ask questions their answers did not inspire confidence hence why I am on here.

My initial concern is the lack of clear equipment list criteria, I would like to go down the ATL route for one person, being in the trade I have been offered various equipment second hand but i am not sure if it will suffice. 

My questions include

Does the lift size matter 3 ton or 4 ton?

What is the definining equipment for ATL which differentiates it from standard TLs, eg what wont fit on to older equipment?

How do I know in advance ifany equipment is VOSA authorised before I purchase?

I am looking for detail which I just can't seem to find clearly stated anywhere so any links would be useful.

Thanks for your help.

 

 

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

Current time is 07:48 pm  
MOT Forum - The MOT Testing Forum for the UK MOT Testing Industry > Trade Category (MOT Trade Discussions) > Equipment Forum - Advice on Parts, Service, Performance etc | MOT Forum > VOSA Not much help Top




UltraBB 1.172 Copyright © 2007-2011 Data 1 Systems